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Owen Meany

AB de Villiers

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DbDraad    595

So I take it you will not be questioning HM's decisions in the future. Or are you supporting Gary merely because is from the WP?

Nope, I support Gary because of what he has achieved in cricket. He took India to a CWC victory and he was the one that brought Vernon into the test picture. We all know how that turned out. I might add that I was also surprised by the selection and was just as skeptical about it than most on here. As for Meyer, I was very disappointed with his initial squad, but some of his selections panned out surprisingly and the ones that did not has been rectified to a large extend. I am quite happy with the state of our rugby ATM and am more than prepared to concede that Heyneke Meyer knows more about rugby than most, myself included. That does not mean that he is exempt from critique. Same goes for Gary, like I said, I would not have continued with AB as keeper beyond the Ozzie series, but would have rather started blooding a young keeper. Your suggestion that my support for Gary is provincialism is unfounded and may just as well point to some provincial bias of your own.

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taipan    1,432

Nope, I support Gary because of what he has achieved in cricket. He took India to a CWC victory and he was the one that brought Vernon into the test picture. We all know how that turned out. I might add that I was also surprised by the selection and was just as skeptical about it than most on here. As for Meyer, I was very disappointed with his initial squad, but some of his selections panned out surprisingly and the ones that did not has been rectified to a large extend. I am quite happy with the state of our rugby ATM and am more than prepared to concede that Heyneke Meyer knows more about rugby than most, myself included. That does not mean that he is exempt from critique. Same goes for Gary, like I said, I would not have continued with AB as keeper beyond the Ozzie series, but would have rather started blooding a young keeper. Your suggestion that my support for Gary is provincialism is unfounded and may just as well point to some provincial bias of your own.

Um no. I you were a regular reader of this cricket forum you would know that I was one of the first to call for his selection as Protea coach and have been one of his biggest supporters. However I still contend that in this instance he is wrong and a number of highly experienced cricketers and cricket writers agree with me in this regard.

The facts are still against AB keeping despite one century against an already destroyed attack papering over the cracks.

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Owen Meany    552

2007 9 16 2 387 77 0 3 27.64 14/–

In 2007 het AB ook nege toetse gespeel teen n gemiddelde van 27.64. Sou jy sê dat hy toe te veel veldwerk gedoen het?

Ek wag nog vir n antwoord.

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taipan    1,432

Ek wag nog vir n antwoord.

You know perfectly well that has nothing to do with the discussion. Batsmen lose and regain form.

you have steadfastly refused to comment on the figures that prove that keeping affects batting.

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taipan    1,432

Nee ek het nie. My standpunt is dat dit nog te vroeg is om n afleiding te maak.

Once again, not the point. The point is that the facts for other players show it does not work, so why take the chance.

Of course he will probably score a kakhuis full of runs against the crappy NZ team that is about to descend upon us.

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Owen Meany    552

Once again, not the point. The point is that the facts for other players show it does not work, so why take the chance.

Of course he will probably score a kakhuis full of runs against the crappy NZ team that is about to descend upon us.

Die punt is dat AB goed genoeg is. Die punt is dat kolwers vorm verloor soos 2007 wys. Die punt is dat jou gemiddelde bereken word deur al jou beurte teen alle spanne selfs NZ. Die punt is dat ons die Engelse en Aussies gewen het met AB op paailtjiewagter.

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taipan    1,432

Die punt is dat AB goed genoeg is. Die punt is dat kolwers vorm verloor soos 2007 wys. Die punt is dat jou gemiddelde bereken word deur al jou beurte teen alle spanne selfs NZ. Die punt is dat ons die Engelse en Aussies gewen het met AB op paailtjiewagter.

And Stewart and Sanga weren't?

The point is that we beat England and Aus with no significant innings from AB. He basically did not contribute.

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DbDraad    595

Um no. I you were a regular reader of this cricket forum you would know that I was one of the first to call for his selection as Protea coach and have been one of his biggest supporters. However I still contend that in this instance he is wrong and a number of highly experienced cricketers and cricket writers agree with me in this regard.

The facts are still against AB keeping despite one century against an already destroyed attack papering over the cracks.

I know about your call for Gary as coach etc. My comment re your bias is that you think my support for Gary is because of his ties with WP, in other words, if a WP supporter is supporting a ex WP player, your first summation is that it's rather as a result of bias than merit. You infer that WP supporters are so blinded by bias that we fail to be objective in almost all issues. That view is also bias in my book.

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taipan    1,432

I know about your call for Gary as coach etc. My comment re your bias is that you think my support for Gary is because of his ties with WP, in other words, if a WP supporter is supporting a ex WP player, your first summation is that it's rather as a result of bias than merit. You infer that WP supporters are so blinded by bias that we fail to be objective in almost all issues. That view is also bias in my book.

Well from my experience on this forum, can you blame me? Or would you disagree that 99% of the attacks on Heyneke Meyer were rooted in provinicial bias?

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Owen Meany    552

Hy het uitstekend gekolf teen Aus. Hy het ook goed gedoen as paaltjiewagter teen albei spanne. Sy bydrae was dubbel wat Boucher ons gebied het. Ons kon n ekstra kolwer speel. Baie positiewe. Toe AB begin speel het was jou opinie dat hy nie n goeie paaltjiewagter is nie. Toe hy jou verkeerd bewys toe gebruik jy die storie van sy rug. Nou dat AB sê dat sy rug geen invloed het op sy spel nie toe is dit sy gemiddeld wat te laag is. Wat gaan jy sê as sy gemiddeld einde volgende jaar weer 50 is?

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DbDraad    595

Well from my experience on this forum, can you blame me? Or would you disagree that 99% of the attacks on Heyneke Meyer were rooted in provinicial bias?

Lets take the Heyneke Meyer issue to the rugby board.

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taipan    1,432

I have always said he is a reasonable keeper, but nowhere near the standard of the top keepers. He still looks very awkward standing up. Outstanding v Aus. really? One score of over 50 in six innings. So what was the mystery injury that kept him out of the CL then?

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DbDraad    595

Hy het uitstekend gekolf teen Aus. Hy het ook goed gedoen as paaltjiewagter teen albei spanne. Sy bydrae was dubbel wat Boucher ons gebied het. Ons kon n ekstra kolwer speel. Baie positiewe. Toe AB begin speel het was jou opinie dat hy nie n goeie paaltjiewagter is nie. Toe hy jou verkeerd bewys toe gebruik jy die storie van sy rug. Nou dat AB sê dat sy rug geen invloed het op sy spel nie toe is dit sy gemiddeld wat te laag is. Wat gaan jy sê as sy gemiddeld einde volgende jaar weer 50 is?

Owen, die paaltjie wagter spel sal altyd 'n faktor wees, so ook kapteinskap. Wat opgeweeg moet word is die volgende: Gaan die negatiewe impak van AB se kolfwerk op paaltjie wagter groter wees as die posetiewe impak van 'n ekstra kolwer in die span? Volgens Taipan en baie ander is die negatiewe impak potensieel groter. Ek het nog nie werklik genoeg gesien om te besluit nie. AB lyk egter sielkundig 'n bietjie broos en paaltjiewagter en kapteinskap kan sy kolfwerk beduiwel. Ek hoop egter hy bewys my verkeerd.

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Owen Meany    552

Owen, die paaltjie wagter spel sal altyd 'n faktor wees, so ook kapteinskap. Wat opgeweeg moet word is die volgende: Gaan die negatiewe impak van AB se kolfwerk op paaltjie wagter groter wees as die posetiewe impak van 'n ekstra kolwer in die span? Volgens Taipan en baie ander is die negatiewe impak potensieel groter. Ek het nog nie werklik genoeg gesien om te besluit nie. AB lyk egter sielkundig 'n bietjie broos en paaltjiewagter en kapteinskap kan sy kolfwerk beduiwel. Ek hoop egter hy bewys my verkeerd.

n Paar goeie punte wat jy maak Draad. Dit is egter nog te vroeg om enige afleidings te maak. Wat wel insigewend is, is die feit dat Kirsten so opgewonde is oor AB se rol as paaltjiewagter. Ek glo eerder die afrigter wat elke dag met die span werk as wat ek ou spelers en joernaliste glo wat Taipan so lief is om aantehaal.

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taipan    1,432

Owen, die paaltjie wagter spel sal altyd 'n faktor wees, so ook kapteinskap. Wat opgeweeg moet word is die volgende: Gaan die negatiewe impak van AB se kolfwerk op paaltjie wagter groter wees as die posetiewe impak van 'n ekstra kolwer in die span? Volgens Taipan en baie ander is die negatiewe impak potensieel groter. Ek het nog nie werklik genoeg gesien om te besluit nie. AB lyk egter sielkundig 'n bietjie broos en paaltjiewagter en kapteinskap kan sy kolfwerk beduiwel. Ek hoop egter hy bewys my verkeerd.

Draad, the problem is that we are throwing away long term strategic planning for short term advantages. AB is the natural successor to Jacques Kallis at 4 and as vice captain, the captain elect when Smith calls it a day. I cannot believe that anyone thinks it a good idea for him to keep, captai and bat at 4.

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Owen Meany    552

Hy het n rugbesering gehad op n stadium en jy wou almal op die forum laat glo dat dit hom sou belemmer om paaltjiewagter te speel. Nou dat dit bewys is dat dit nie enige langtermyn efek gehad het nie kan jy nie erken dat jy verkeerd was nie.

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DbDraad    595

Draad, the problem is that we are throwing away long term strategic planning for short term advantages. AB is the natural successor to Jacques Kallis at 4 and as vice captain, the captain elect when Smith calls it a day. I cannot believe that anyone thinks it a good idea for him to keep, captai and bat at 4.

Agreed, we do not want to get into the same boat as Ozz did with a team that got too old. India is also there. I would not make AB test captain and would strongly advise that they find another captain for the shorter formats as well. There are no clear candidates though.

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Docker    437

Agreed, we do not want to get into the same boat as Ozz did with a team that got too old. India is also there. I would not make AB test captain and would strongly advise that they find another captain for the shorter formats as well. There are no clear candidates though.

Teams get too old because there is no one better coming through. Ponting would have been arseholed two years ago if there was some young batsmen making a truck load of runs at domestic level. Plus you don't leave Kallis out because he is too old despite averaging 75 since turning 35. Of course when he retires in 2-3 years time and cannot be replaced everyone is going to say that there was a lack of planning to replace him.

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taipan    1,432

Agreed, we do not want to get into the same boat as Ozz did with a team that got too old. India is also there. I would not make AB test captain and would strongly advise that they find another captain for the shorter formats as well. There are no clear candidates though.

The two oldest players in the team (apart from JK) are the openers, so Amla has to stay at three when we start replacing them. AB should move to 5, Faf to 5 and JP at six. QDK would then be the natural 7 and is virtually a frontline batsman in any event.

Maybe I am the only one looking at the long game.

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vlagman    914

Interesting how we are told that the rugby and cricket scenarios are so totally diifferent. Gary had success in his first major coaching job. So did HM, albeit not from the word go. Everybody left out a sigh of relief when Gary was appointed. Same with HN. Gary drew his first series as coach, losing one test, and at home as well. Then we managed to win the series against Sri Lanka despite losing one of the tests in the series. Never was Gary in doubt as the coach. HM was bashed right from the first test against England and his reputation only recovered slightly after winning the last game of the season.Morne Steyn was singled out as the main culprit right from the first test of 2012. AB has had one single really good innings in ages, but we have to wait. He should be fine some time. Morne Steyn was overplayed and everybody knew that but he had to piss off. AB should not be keeping. Statistics and history supports that, but we have to wait........

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taipan    1,432

Interesting how we are told that the rugby and cricket scenarios are so totally diifferent. Gary had success in his first major coaching job. So did HM, albeit not from the word go. Everybody left out a sigh of relief when Gary was appointed. Same with HN. Gary drew his first series as coach, losing one test, and at home as well. Then we managed to win the series against Sri Lanka despite losing one of the tests in the series. Never was Gary in doubt as the coach. HM was bashed right from the first test against England and his reputation only recovered slightly after winning the last game of the season.Morne Steyn was singled out as the main culprit right from the first test of 2012. AB has had one single really good innings in ages, but we have to wait. He should be fine some time. Morne Steyn was overplayed and everybody knew that but he had to piss off. AB should not be keeping. Statistics and history supports that, but we have to wait........

Exactly why the Heyneke Meyer scenario should not be moved to the rugby board. Odd that it is acceptable to bash Heyneke Meyer but Gazza is untouchable.

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DbDraad    595

Exactly why the Heyneke Meyer scenario should not be moved to the rugby board. Odd that it is acceptable to bash Heyneke Meyer but Gazza is untouchable.

I have not criticized Meyer since his initial squad was named and I have since conceded that I was wrong about Kirshner. I stand 100 % behind Meyer as coach and if acceptable to the rest of the members, I would be more than prepared to discuss Meyer on the cricket board.

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